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what do you call a Filipino admixed with different groups brought in during Manila Acapulco Galleon Trade??

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Filipino with Spanish or European ancestry is called a Mestizo.  However Spain did bring Native American Indians to Philippines and some of them interbred with the local Filipinos.  What do you call a Filipino with recent Native American Indian Ancestry such as Mayan, Aztec, Inca? 

Biracial, Multiracial sounds too general to me, were there actual classification/description for these people during those times?  They would appear Native by enlarge but would they be considered Native Indio? 

Some say they are called Colloquially Tisoy which are Filipinos mixed in with any foreign ancestry but again that's too general, they probably had a more appropriate description.

 

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nenabunena
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@prau123  They're just seen as regular Filipinos.

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And they would not be mistaken as Mestizos or Ladinos. Several would look like regular Filipinos, but I've actually seen Mexican Indians-Filipinos and they look nothing like typical Filipinos.  Especially when they are young, their physique is more meatier, physically stronger and more athletic than the average Filipino. This stockier and more robust built comes from their Mexican Indian side. Their somatotype muscle type is mesomorphic.  Filipinos are usually endomorphic and ectomorphic somatotype however there are several Filipinos who do have mesomorphic muscles.  

 

 

 

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nenabunena
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@prau123. I'm mixed actually but both parents are Filipinos.  I also have Mexican ancestry from my mom's side and Micronesian from my father.  But we're all lanky and tall, not robust at all unless we get fat, lol.  But our Mexican isnt much, only over 6% for me & that doesnt even mean I got all 6.25.%.  For all I know zilch NA genes were passed on to me.  But my mom had a very very high NA nose that she had filed down to make her look more pango.  I'm high bridged as well but not NA high bridge, just Caucasian high bridge.

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@nenabunena

 

 

We probably should give you a separate classification since you have a drop of Micronesian and Mexican blood in you?  😆  Mexican ancestry from your mother side is definitely Spanish since you mentioned that the NA genes is negligible.  I'm assuming it was your mother's doctor that filed down her nose to look more pango.  I actually see nothing wrong have a high bridged nose since it's not commonly seen among Filipinos.

 

 

 

 

 

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nenabunena
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@prau123. Not necessarily because I also have Spanish, portuguese, and German ancestry.  But specifically mexican, German, Micronesian, and portuguese is negligible because they all just total 25%.  Old mestizos in the Philippines are not just Filipino and Spanish, they are a hodgepodge of everything.  We see ourselves as Filipino first, everything is 2nd to that.  Because mestizos died and fought in The Philippine revolution and ww2,  don't mistake us for the Chinese who dont mix and see themselves as Chinese first before Filipino.

 

My parents are very pro Filipino,  they wanted to look more Filipino and be seen as Filipinos.  This anti mestizo whatever, I don't know where this came from, maybe filams who are cutoff from their culture and language and think blood trumps all of that.

 

I watched a fung bros video where a mestizo Filipino who looks Filipino imo, and owned, cooked, promoted Filipino culture and cuisine through his restaurant, who also had a typical Filipino accent was called a colonizer by some filam who knew next to nothing about the Philippines and its people and was clearly ashamed of her heritage.  Unbelievable.

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I actually wouldn't consider 25% negligible but you probably wouldn't consider yourself a Mestizo.  The specific term would be Cholo which is 3/4th Indio and a quarter European.  I agree Mestizos in Philippines are a halo-halo mix. You mentioned previously that you have Micronesian ancestry which is also a highly mixed group of people which suggest that you likely have Spanish ancestry from your Micronesian side also.  Our national dog is considered a halo-halo mix such as Askal dog/ Aspin and other mongrels and mutts.  

 

I also agree that Filipinos in Philippines that have mix ancestry from Europe consider themselves Filipinos first and everything is second to that.  Even pure Spaniards and Castizos in Philippines consider themselves Filipinos first. 

It's good that your family is pro-Filipino but I wouldn't mind seeing them recognizing their variety of heritage. Some Fil-Am may have some grudge against Mestizos because of how they treated us.  I see both sides - good and not-so-good.  

 

In East-Timor Leste, some people over there recognize their Portuguese ancestry even though they consider themselves Timorese first while everything else considered second.

 

 

 

 

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nenabunena
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@prau123. 25% is the total for Micronesian, German, Mexican, and portuguese so half of them aren't even european.  Micronesian are austronesians very similar to Filipinos.  And they all individually only make up over 6% so it is very very negligible.

 

I am still majority Fiipino Auatronesian, followed by Spanish, the others negligible.

 

Also we no longer use any of those terms.  We are just Filipinos.  Last,  even if I have those ancestors, it doesnt mean that I am that percentage,  I couldve gotten the 6% Mexican but it could also be 1%, because your parents don't distribute the genes equally.

 

I don't know if I have Spanish from the Micronesian ancestry, but I got the German from it.  My great grandfather was half Micronesian and half German raised by Capuchin priests and smuggled to the Philippines when war broke out in Micronesia and killed his father.

 

That's why my family doesn't have tribal mentality, we are Filipino first, mestizo, Tagalog, waray, and ilokano a far 2nd.  My Filipino is also mixed, I am equal Tagalog/ilokano and a quarter waray.

 

We recognize we are mixed but only like a tagalog with Capuano roots sees themselves.  We have mestizo food but we also eat all the Filipino food and culture.  Also mestizos are well integrated here, and intermix heavily.  My grandmother for example has no Filipino blood but married a pure filipino.  I think foreigners just don't understand how it is here and try to apply their racism here.

 

I dont how mestizos in the Philippines couldve treated filams badly,  they're world's away and filams tend to be more American than Filipino anyway.  Chinese Filipinos and even koreans raised here tend to be more Filipino than filams with the food, culture, language, and accent even.

 

 

 

 

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@nenabunena

 

You are really a mixed person not only foreign mix but also your Native Filipino side is rather mixed. 

Although you view yourself as a Filipino first, you are probably among the few who view themselves as having foreign ancestry.  How do others view you when they see some of your foreign ethnic features?  To me it doesn't matter much because you are a Filipino regardless but I do somehow feel that you and several are consciously connected to your foreign ethnic background.

Fil-Ams feel like this towards Mestizos because they are not currently living in the Philippines.  Their views are their parents and grandparents view in general and not their actual experience.  They are not wrong entirely to view Mestizos either. Personally, I've met good and bad Mestizos but it's no different from here in America, there are good and not-so-good people regardless of their background.

Foreigners who visit the Philippines have a tendency of bringing their western mind to the country as if they expect the local Filipinos to understand what they are talking.  I've seen Filipinos say to foreigners, "I really do not understand what you are saying."  Foreigners also expect Filipinos to behave and talk as if they are Americans, Australians or Europeans which doesn't make any sense to me one bit.  

 

 

 

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nenabunena
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@prau123. Actually a lot of the old mestizos here see themselves as Filipino first too.  Filam mestizos to me are no different from other filipino-americans.  They are similar with them culturally and we are more similar with Filipinos culturally.

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@nenabunena

 

I've known some Filipino Mestizos and they view themselves as Filipinos first and their varied foreign ethnic background is considered for the most part secondary. Pure Filipinos view Filipino Mestizos as Filipinos also.

Fil-Am and Fil-Am Mestizos are similar and when they have to visit Philippines they too have to enculturate themselves to the culture of the local Filipinos.

 

 

 

 

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jason
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moreno, Indio, mestizo, negrito, yellow chinese

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It could have been Indio since a half-Mayan, half-Filipino would appear Native looking still for the most part and wouldn't appear similar to a Mestizo.  However Spaniards still considered pure Filipinos as Indio.  Moreno refers to color regardless if the person is pure or a mix. Negrito refers to mainly pure Australoid descendants but it was also referred to those who have some of their ancestry. Those descriptions were actually used by Spaniards during those times.

 

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nenabunena
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@prau123. True on the Moreno referring skin color, not whether your pure native Filipino or mestizo.  My father was the only Moreno in his family for example and that Visconde massacre, the family Webb's defense is that the witnesses all described maputing mestizo when Hubert is Moreno.

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Flower Girl
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something like this

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@flower-girl

 

 

 

I'm glad I wasn't born during those times.  The original Filipinos such as Indio and Negritos are at the lower end of the stick.

 

I did notice that there are two ranking systems that were posted.  They are both similar except the first one puts Sangley above Mestizos de Espanola followed by Tornatras while the second puts Tornatras above Mestizos de Espanola and then Sangley.

 

Actually some Mestizos could pass up as Peninsulares/Insulares-Criollos and vice versa some Mestizos could pass up as pure Filipinos.   Mestizos is defined as a person whose parents are Spanish and Filipino in Philippines and they appear somewhere in between.  Castizos are 3/4 Spanish and a quarter Indio and they were probably in similar ranking as Peninsulares/Insulares-Criollos.  Cholos are a quarter Spanish and 3/4th Indio and they were probably in the same ranking as Indios.

 

Americano was included which suggest that this ranking system was only made as early as the turn of the twentieth century.  The term only referred to people of European descent. 

 

 

 

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@prau123

This colonial mentality still has a mental effect on us, it makes me angry when I see Filipino wanting to be Spanish blooded so bad. 

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@flower-girlc

 

I've heard older Filipinos discuss this before about someone wanting to be Spanish but the person that they were talking about was someone I personally never knew or have seen before.

I could only recall one instance where an older Filipina lady wanting to marry a Spanish man only because she enjoys watching Telenovelas ( Soap Operas ).    

 

 

 

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Do you mean in the Phils? I don't think there are Spanish soap Operas in the Philippines. 

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@flower-girl

 

 

 

Spanish soap operas were available in Philippines since mid-90's.  The first one is La Traidora, but famous one is Marimar and there were several more.

 

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nenabunena
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@prau123. Mexican soaps were popular in the 90s but not anymore, filipinos are obsessed with korean soaps now.

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I wonder why they never brought American soap operas into Philippines and they don't have to dubbed the words when the actors/actress speaks.

 

 

 

 

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@prau123  I remember they had days of our lives and knotts landing in the past.  But they weren't as popular as the Mexican And korean telenovelas.

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@nenabunena

 

I only remember seeing Mexican telenovelas, because tv had only one channel and during the afternoon they would show soap operas.

 

 

 

 

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There are more channels today and that' probably why I didn't see any soap operas recently. Btw, I actually don't watch soap operas.  As matter of fact when I'm in Philippines I don't watch much tv shows in general.  The popular shows they air on tv now a days are comedy game shows.

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nenabunena
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@prau123  Game shows has been popular here since Eat Bulaga started over 40 years ago I think.

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@nenabunena

 

It's their favorite show and it attracts all ages.  They should bring over some of those comedy game shows here in the states and it may become popular among American audience.

 

 

 

 

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@prau123

I did not know that, We should a pop culture thread for oversea Filipinos who are interested in reconnecting with their cultural heritage. 

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@flower-girl

 

 

Overseas Filipinos would definitely like that. They usually miss their family members and friends back home.  Some also miss their way of life in Philippines. Overseas Filipinos usually arrived here in America or Canada as an adult and they tend to struggle to adapt to a western culture because they didn't grew up in grade school here.

 

 

 

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@flower-girl. I think it's because we don't value our own history.  Out precolonial past is simply a footnote in history class.  Our history books should all be updated imo and promote education as of primary importance to Filipinos.  We should also translate books to Filipino or bisaya, keeping it in English simply promotes the majority of common filipinos not bothering to read.  The only books in Filipino are all political or social commentary books,  and the only ones who read that are Filipino majors or as a school requirement.  You have to encourage people to read for leisure, that means the lower, middle,and high class all read similar books for escapism.  We should also promote our own literature,  by that, I mean escapism entertaining books to jumpstart getting the majority used to reading and promoting the language as an intellectual language.  Filipino is so easy to spell but many dont even know how to spell a phonetic language, that is sad.

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If they had to teach pre-colonial past, they would have to consider oral traditions from the native Filipinos but largely the lessons in schools and institutions will be related to genetics and how the Austronesians migrated from Southeast Asia to the Indonesia and then to Philippines.  Philippines government has to do more archaeological, anthropological and genetic research.

 

 

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@prau123. True but we have enough info to change history books.  I mean the 3 wave migration theory is still taught hence why Filipinos are still insecure and ignorant.  There was this filams with the fung bros who said China colonized us!  He mustve gotten that from his parents I can only imagine.

 

Also we have to sift through oral tradition because filipinos are fond of kwentong barbero, lol.  

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@nenabunena

 

 

I agree we have to verify a lot of these oral traditions however several of them do have some kernel of truth in them, it's just that over time the oral history passed down from one generation to the next gets muddled in the process. Funny, Filipinas especially spends 8 hours at a local hair salon and they are fond of kwentong barbero.

 

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@nenabunena

 

I agree people should be encouraged to read for leisure regardless.  Filipinos go to internet cafes to play video games primarily instead of reading articles and books. Besides Colleges/Universities, I actually don't recall any Public libraries in Philippines where people could go to and read or check out a book to read. When I was in Philippines, I don't recall anyone reading books.  They prefer to watch the movie versions of the book instead of reading the original version which is the book version.

Some Filipinos are not aware of their recent history let alone pre-colonial past. 

 

 

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nenabunena
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@prau123 This so much.  We do have a public library in Manila but the only ones who go there are people in academic circles, the masses certainly don't.  You have to promote your language through literature if you want Filipinos to see it as an intellectual language.

 

What use is the skill to speak English if that is the only skill you can boast of?  To become an ofw in the service or labor industry?

 

We need to promote our own industries here and promote other skills, english should be secondary to that.

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@nenabunena

 

 

 

Some books at libraries in Manila were probably sold and given away to give space for e-books such as computers and tablets. 

 

Filipinos would rather get their information at the internet cafe and study there as well instead of the library.

 

At malls, they have the National Bookstore and only some Filipinos buy books. 

 

The older generation are the ones mainly that reads books since some are not using the computer and a few actually don't use the cellphones also.

 

 

 

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nenabunena
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@prau123. Be that as it may, then write Filipino ebooks.  Right?

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@nenabunena

 

Agree.  I prefer reading books than e-books. I've never read a novel on e-book before.  Who reads a novels on a computer???  

 

 

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@prau123. You can read on a tablet or ebook?  Plus a lot of dual screen phones and dual laptops nowadays.

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@nenabunena

 

 

Several have made that switch already. Youngsters especially have started to read on dual screen phones and laptops. Eventually libraries and bookstores will become defunct.  People who prefer still to read books on hardbacks or paperbacks are what's keeping those places alive.   

 

 

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@prau123. Exactly on tablets and phones so no excuse not to read.  But I disagree books and papers will never go extinct unless we've cut down every tree and I think people will noy allow that to happen

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@nenabunena

 

 

I've been going back to Philippines regularly in the last few years and I haven't seen any Filipinos read a book as if the hardbacks and paperbacks went extinct already.  I would also visit the internet cafes and I didn't see anyone read a novel on the computer.  Some students would read articles but several were either playing videos games or on facebook or another social media.

 

I'm sure Filipinos in schools do read books only because it's part of the course requirement in class. 

On the other hand, would they chose to read a book on their own for leisure or out of their own volition?  Would they go to a library or a bookstore and pick up reading on the side?  I have to say only a few would begin reading books. 

 

 

 

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nenabunena
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@prau123  The Philippines doesn't have a literary tradition.  It doesn't help that everything is written in english and most filipinos aren't that fluent so why would they read?  If we had fostered it early, I believe there would've been more readers here, more literary works, and more options & opportunities for the lower classes because reading offers that.

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@nenabunena

 

I agree and the computers at the internet cafe and at their house are nothing more than for them to play video games or get on social media.  There were some older generation that did read books because there were no computers nor a television nor a telephone in every house back in those days and therefore reading books was available. There are Filipinos that do read newspapers regularly.

 

 

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In Philippines, the most commonly read book in nearly every age group is the Bible.  The only exceptions were the young adults and children but 55% of the youth claimed to read the Bible. 

The question is did Filipinos actually read the whole Bible book?  The Bible has somewhere around 1,200 pages. 

Since several Filipinos don't read novels that on average are around 180 pages in length then what's more with the Bible that has 1,200 pages.  I believe that the majority only read a portion of the Bible.  

 

 

 

 

The most commonly read book in the Philippines? Survey says: the Bible (catholicnewsagency.com)

 

The most commonly read book in the Philippines? Survey says: the Bible

 

 

.-

 

A recent survey found that the Bible is the most frequently read book in the Philippines.

The country’s National Book Development Board commissioned a readership survey for 2017, the results of which were released earlier this year.

More than 72 percent of adults were found to favor reading the Bible over other literary genres, including fiction, non-fiction, hobbies, health, and graphic novels.

The finding was consistent for nearly all age groups, except for young adults and children, demographics among which the Bible is the fourth most commonly read book. Still, more than 55 percent of youth reported that they read the Bible.

 

 

On average, how many pages are in the bible?

 

... These are made up of 31,173 verses and using a rough word count, this amounts to 807,370 words, although the King James Authorized Bible has 783,137 words. Using a standard font, the average bible has around 1,200 pagesFeb 21, 2016

 

 

 

 

 

 
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@prau123  Finally found this, lol!  I do believe that Filipinos have read parts of the Bible but the entirety?  Possible.  Why?  Most schools here are Catholic and we have theology classes until college/university.  So that's 5/days a week theology from kinder until you finish highschool & 2x/week for college/university. But theology is not just the Bible, it's interpretation, catechism, singing, memorizing prayers/songs, saints, etc.  So they won't be reading the entirety of the bible for 15 or so years.  They may have started reading it at the beginning in elementary and move on to more complex topics on it, that unfortunately many theology professors are not equipped to teach.  But this is the case for other subjects too, unfortunately.  I mean I'm sure we went through my biology book back in elementary but do many of us remember it?

 

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@nenabunena

 

Filipinos mainly read the passages, verses, scriptures, psalms, say a prayer, quotes, proverbs in the Bible. However I doubt that several Filipino have ever delve into the historical accounts in the Bible.  They may know the story of Genesis, Adam and Eve, how Jesus Christ was visited by three kings, the Flood Story, and Virgin Mary but the Bible book has actually several more stories than what's being taught in general. The Bible book is basically a history book of events and people in ancient times. I rarely heard from people including devout Filipino Catholics and Priest that discuss about the historical events that took place in the Bible.

 

 

 

 

 

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@prau123  Filipinos who go to Catholic school are required to read this.  But it doesn't mean they will remember much in the end because like I said, they delve into other theology matters.

 

The Bible is actually not 1 book, it is a collection, a library of books.  And yes many books are historical but not all, some are prayers, poems, allegories, etc.

 

You should visit my school then, my catechism, our priests' homilies, my Church group, my father and his family often debated and talked about its history and catechism.  & believe me, in our group, I'm one of the dumbest about it, lol!  

 

But in the provinces, and even in Manila we have a lot of pasang-awa priests like any other profession here, unfortunately.  There are the ones who are top of the class or the most passionate or curious, & there are those who barely scraped by a passing grade.  yikes.

 

Schooling in the Philippines is different from the US.  I believe there you can pass without opening a book or any required reading.  Here a requirement is a requirement, it is read out loud, there are assignments, & tests every day, 2x/day for each subject, not including exams & long tests, research papers, & projects, etc.

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@nenabunena

 

 

There are some that probably know the historical accounts in the Bible but it's rarely ever mentioned in Mass however I only attend church during holidays.  The Priest basically discusses about his past experience and relates it with the story in the Bible and he sermons a moral lesson. I guess majority of people attending Mass mainly want to hear a Priest preach moral stories and uplifting speeches along with songs such as hymns and music instead of the historical accounts in the Bible.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Here a requirement is a requirement, it is read out loud, there are assignments, & tests every day, 2x/day for each subject, not including exams & long tests, research papers, & projects, etc.

 

 

Explains why several Filipino Priest are in demand here in states.  There are some Filipino Masses here that are in Tagalog.   

 

 

 

 

 

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@nenabunena

I totally agree. Just look at our young generation of oversea Filipinos who have a identity crisis. Cultural education will give oversea Filipinos a sense of belonging.

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@prau123. Lets be honest "indios" were not original Filipinos if you mean in the native sense.  They too were colonizers,  theres a reason negritos only make up 1-2% of the population and why their original language is extinct.  The Spaniards and Americans have done neither to us and in fact have contributed in preserving our culture more so than Malays and Indonesians who are heavily arabized and have lost their austronesian culture.

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@nenabunena

 

I do recognize that the original people were the Negritos however Austronesians such as us have been on the island for several thousands of years and I do believe that we have been in Philippines far longer than 5,000 years ago as claimed by several scientist. 

 

Native American Indians are considered the original people but not all of them went from Siberia to America at the same time.  Only the first wave that arrived in America has the claim to be considered the original people or first people which was around 15,000 to 25,000 years ago.  Native Indian groups that arrived later are considered Native Indios still because they also have been there for several thousands of years although they were considered second or third wave arriving

 

Even before the Negritos in Philippines there were different Australoids such as Papuans.  There were also different hominids that arrived in Philippines before the Australoid group or any Homosapien such as Homo Luzonensis in Luzon Island and Tabon Man in Palawan Island.  They are the original people.

 

 

 

 

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nenabunena
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@prau123. Thats the thing though.  I see myself as Native too but honestly do the negritos see us as Natives?  Does it really matter how long we've been in the Philippines if Negritos are still around and are both culturally and phenotypically different from us?  Thats like the Japanese stating they are of equal nativeness as the ainus.  We simply aren't and we have to be honest that we marginalize and oppress the negritos.  I doubt they are grateful for our mistreatment of them and the destruction if their culture and language.  We austronesians dont have the high ground here just bad we got away with it for so long.  See how Indonesians treat the papuans.

 

 

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@nenabunena

 

 

 

When I was in Philippines, I talk to some of the Negritos during the holiday when they came down from the rural mountainous areas to walk on bare food for several kilometers to the city/towns nearby and celebrate with us Filipinos.   They are nice people and although Filipinos in general do not mingle with them, we also do not mistreat them either from what I know and have seen thus far.  They seem to be happy with their lives as natives but I really don't know if they view us as natives also. I'm sure they know their oral history that they are the original people of the land before the Austronesians arrived, therefore they view us a foreigners but not necessarily as invaders. They probably don't have a concept of "private land ownership" much like the way some Native American Indians viewed their land.  To them, the land does not belong to humans; the land, the water, the air we breathe belongs to GOD only.  The land was meant to be shared and not owned. 

 

I've always wanted to know how Negritos viewed us Austronesians.  Did they have any grudge against us much the same way the Native American Indians have grudge against the colonial Europeans?  Somehow I didn't get that impression from the Negritos when I was there but I don't live in Philippines, I've only been going back there recently.

 

 

 

 

 

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nenabunena
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@prau123. They are dependent on us and we dont currently mistreat them "the same way" Indonesians treat the Papuans.  But they are marginalized and looked down upon by many Filipinos, even those who call them beautiful.  Believe me.  We like to think we're not racist but we are.

 

The European colonization of the Americas is very recent to ours so their memories are strong and they still have a semblance of their language left.  The Negrito culture and language has been wiped out and yes, even their population.  No matter how you dress it up that they are nice to their conquerors, it doesnt change that fact.  

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@nenabunena

 

Unfortunately there are Filipinos that do look down at them but when I was there Negritos don't seem to react badly like the way African Americans react badly here in the states. Several Filipinos don't stare down, or show distastefulness or make a negative remark at the Negritos.  Filipinos in general don't do anything towards them.  I personally view them as Filipino as I am or anyone in Philippines. However the country, the government, the schools should teach Filipinos to show more appreciation towards Negritos and learn their contribution and show more of them on television and media in general.

 

European colonization of the Americas is as long as Philippines actually.  Philippines was being governed in Mexico.  Mexico (New Spain) included all of the western half of U.S.A. including Louisiana to Florida and  Southernmost-western parts of Canada.  Spain constructed Missions up to Alaska. Native American Indians suffered the most, they lost most of their people, culture, land, language and several are still bitter about this even to this day.   

 

 

 

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nenabunena
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@prau123. European colonization of the americas treated the natives far worse than they did here,  the Church made sure not to repeat what happened in the Americas. Also,  I was referring to austronesian colonization, not European as responsible for destroying the Negrito.  African American ancestors were brought into the US to use as slaves, I don't know of any similar treatment of Negritos.  Yet African Americans were also given many opportunities later on that negritos dont get.  I'd say NA treatment is more similar.  Growing up, filipinos whether they're rich or poor, always make disparaging remarks about negritos.  Thats one of the worst insults you can make at a Filipino actually.  I have a friend, shes pure filipina and shes from the lower middle class but her mouth is a barrage of black and Negrito insults, but people love her nonetheless because her mentality is common.  I've talked to her many times about it but that's how she is and everyone around her dont see whats wrong with her comments because they all think it.

You can see it better in children I think.

 

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@nenabunena

 

We really have little to roughly no historical documentation on how Austronesians treated Negritos in Philippines.  I presume it's no different than how Austronesians in Indonesia treated Negritos and Papuans in the remote past.  I just don't get the impression from several Negritos that they were mistreated as badly.  I'm sure some were mistreated badly but I have to visit more of these tribal groups before making any conclusion however it's nearly impossible to visit their actual tribe which is located in rural jungle mountainous areas.  I've talk to some Negritos in Panay Island and Mindoro Island and they don't seem to have any grudge towards Filipinos.  These Negritos that I did talk with are usually traveling back and forth to the city from the rural mountains and therefore they have adapted to the city/town.  The Negritos in Mindoro Island are actually receiving education and medical attention from the local government.  Some have already adapted to local Filipinos.  In general however there are several Filipinos that do have Negrito admixture in them. Their phenotypical expression is predominantly SE Asian with some Negrito features. In general, Filipinos are use to seeing Filipinos with Negrito admixtures and some are actually well received by Filipinos.  Negritos have a large land on several islands and they are usually located on productive lands unlike Native American Indians in the states and Australian Aborigines in Australia.  

 

Unfortunately, I find the Filipinos that insult these Negritos as rather degrading.  Several Filipinos have never met any of these Negritos and yet they actually believe in their stereotypes.  Why don't they meet and talk with the Negritos and possibly they may have a different view of them.

 

 

 

Map of Negrito, Ati in Philippines

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

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nenabunena
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@prau123. True we don't have documentation, all we have is the result: they are only 1-2% of the population with negligible gene flow from them, they no longer speak their language,  and as you say are more than happy to abandon their culture to be austronesian Filipino culturally.

 

I'm sure you and many here find Filipinos who disparage negritos despicable but I bet if you met my friend you would love her. As for travelling to visit negritos, why would they?  They have their own problems to deal with and Filipinos tend to have insulated views,  they live in the present, and are happy go lucky.  Studying the past is a hassle, preparing for the future is a hassle, caring about those worse off than you is a hassle, etc.

 

Idw thats just how many are.  Their mentality is, why bother with poor "ugly" black negritos when you can bother with rich pretty white koreans?  Its a killjoy as they say.

 

But many foreigners are the same, how many Americans or Australians care for the indigenous over kpop?  But filipinos tend to be very extreme maybe because of the poverty or perceived poverty, Idk

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@nenabunena

 

 

Filipinos could actually talk to these Negritos since they are some times commonly seen on the city.  If Filipinos could talk to foreigners then they should be able to talk to the Negritos. They are friendly people.

I actually met Negritos in the city during the holiday festivities.  They come down from the rural jungle mountains as a family and basically they just hung out in a corner or in the park and the kids would play together while the parents watched over them.  They are approachable and I came up to the father and said," Merry Christmas" and he responded by saying the same thing.  I was be able to see them and others even pass New Years.  There were Filipino school kids that did talk to the Negrito kids but it's rare to see any interaction.   Another place was at a tribal reserve where tourist could visit and buy souvenirs. I was able to talk with them for several minutes but these Negritos have been enculturated to the local Filipinos.  They were talking to foreigners also and I bought a souvenir basket from them. 

I agree that the Filipinos are usually living in the present and are happy-go-lucky, and they have things to take care of but I don't see why they couldn't talk to them at least once. I see Filipinos talk basically every day with their family members, extended family members, their neighbors, friends, co-workers, hairstylist, tricycle and jeepney drivers, priest, classmates, sari-sari store owner, cash register at the local market. 

 

 

 

 

 

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nenabunena
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@prau123. Try to remember,  negritos make up 1_2% of the population.  That's not very common.  And Filipinos will not approach random strangers just for a chat.  If they met them in school, work, at an event, etc that would be different.  I was really weirded out when random strangers in the US said hi to me.  I was so shocked that I didnt even know how to respond.  Filipinos are friendly but only if there is a reason to talk to you or an acceptable way to approach you.

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@nenabunena

 

 

Really? Depending on what region in Philippines.  Filipinos in Manila area and Visayan Regions are considered more sociable and they are receptive when you approach them.  I see Filipinos coming up to strangers in Philippines quite regularly especially in Provinces - maybe because kababayans are fond of rumors, gossips, and stories. Filipinos are viewed as approachable people and some times friendship is quickly made on the spot.  They may not know each other at first but immediately the conversation bonds their friendship.  Filipinos like to view other Filipinos as family members, friends, or at least an acquaintance especially the older generation.

 

In America or Canada, Filipinos are influence by western culture.  

 

Recently I've been traveling back to Philippines as a balikbayan after being away from the country for several years.  I do talk to my relatives and Filipino people in general but I also did talk to Negritos. Unfortunately, some Filipinos do have these preconceive notion of Negritos that prevents them from ever talking to them and making friends with them. 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

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nenabunena
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@prau123  Filipinos are approachable yes and usually open in social gatherings but I have never ever encountered some random stranger greeting me as I walk by here, only in the US.

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@nenabunena

 

Several Filipinos have several Filipino friends and I got the impression that some of them were encountered randomly especially in Provinces and Barrios.

 

 

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@nenabunena

 

 

I'm assuming your friend has never actually talked to these Negritos before and she lives in Philippines.  Several Filipinos talk about these people from a third-person point of view and yet they never actually met them before.

 

 

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@prau123. I doubt she has nor has she ever seen one.  But her remarks are not negrito targeted specifically, they're sweeping remarks against all black people.  Shes from the lower income and isnt very pc tbh.

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@nenabunena

 

 

 

 

When I was there in Philippines, I saw the Negritos infrequently as well but I'm aware that they do visit the cities and towns enough that the locals have seen them before. I'm surprise that your friend hasn't seen one since she herself is a native Filipina. Instead of ranting about them, why doesn't she attempt to see one for the first time and talk to them.

 

 

 

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@prau123  Most Filipinos have not seen a negrito except when on a field trip to subic.  You can live your whole life in the Philippines, and most of us are native Filipinos (there are no foreign Filipinos here, they are rare if they exist, no diff from a tourist) and never encounter a negrito.

 

She doesn't rant against negritos, she just finds them beneath her.  Most filipinos don't rant against them but look down on them.

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@nenabunena

 

I guess it depends where the person resides.  I was able to see them on every visit of mine in the last few years.  I'm sure some have seen them in the wild such as the rural jungles and mountains. They are outspoken and physically built strong.  I do recall one time at the public market where a Negrito was talking out loud and playing the horn instrument and hitting the drums.  Another recent moment was a youngster who was shouting out loud to the Jeepney driver to stop so she could hop in and join the ride.  Some Festivals such as Ati-Atihan or Dinagyang and possibly some more events that commemorates Negritos while some Negritos do actually drop by and either participate or watch the event.  Some Filipino locals do actually see them during those special occasions.

 

 

 

 

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nenabunena
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@prau123  You have 4 replies to me & this is the only one I've found.  Hays.  Sorry for the late reply, just very busy & now, can't even find your replies.

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Germinator
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Whats a tornatras?

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@germinator

 

 

 

Tornatras is defined somewhat differently in Philippines compared to Latin American countries.

 

 

 

 

TORNATRAS

 

Tornatrás (Spanish pronunciation: [toɾnaˈtɾas]) is an outdated term used in Spain to describe a person of mixed European and albino ancestry or a descendant of mestizos and specific characteristics of one of the original races.[1]

It was also used in the Philippines during the Spanish colonial era from the 16th to 19th century, to describe persons of mixed indigenous Malay (referred to as Indio), Chinese (referred to as Sangley), and Spanish ancestry (referred to as Filipino or Peninsular).

There are no official statistics on the number of people of Tornatrás ancestry around the world, although it is believed that most are to be found in South America and the Philippines.

 

 

HISTORY

Although Tornatrás was originally used to describe a descendant of mestizos, albinos and Europeans, in the Philippines they were commonly known as those born from a Spanish father ('Filipino' or 'peninsular') and a Malay-Chinese (mestiza de sangley) mother.

Most people of the Tornatrás caste in the Philippines used Spanish as their primary language and in many cases converted to the Catholic faith.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Tornatrás () is a caste term used in the Philippines during the Spanish colonial era from the 16th to 19th century to describe persons of mixed indigenous Malay (referred to as Indio), Chinese (referred to as Sangley), and Spanish ancestry (referred to as Filipino or Peninsular). The term comes from the Spanish words tornar, meaning 'to turn', and atrás, meaning 'back'. Hence, the term means "to turn back."

Present-day distribution

There are no official statistics on the number of people of Tornatrás ancestry in the Philippines, as it has not been officially used as a legal term since the end of the Spanish colonial era.

History

Persons of the Tornatrás caste were legally classified as 'blanco' (white), along with filipinos (Spaniards born in the Philippines), peninsulares (Spaniards born in Spain), and mestizos of Spanish-Malay descent, and lived in the racially segregated Intramuros, where persons who were not legally classified as white were not allowed to live.

Those born in the Tornatrás caste were commonly born from a Spanish father ('filipino' or 'peninsular') and a Malay-Chinese (mestiza de sangley) mother as only white men were legally allowed to marry non-white women. White women were prohibited from marrying non-white men as it was against the social mores of the time. If a mestiza de sangley (Malay-Chinese) or india (Malay) married a Spaniard (filipino or peninsular), she was legally classified as 'white' and was allowed to live in Intramuros...

 

 

 

 

 

 

The term used for people who possess Chinese, Spanish, and Filipino ancestries are called " Tornatras." ...

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

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Germinator
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@prau123

it sounds like taco chips 😛

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@germinator

 

 

Taco Tuesday today!  Who knows maybe that's where the taco chips name comes from originally?  Tornatras dish is probably a mix dish like the name suggest.

 

 

 

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During Manila Acapulco Galleon Trade, Filipinos, Mestizos, Spaniards and Native American Indians were sailing on Spanish Galleons as crew members.  One of the main islands to pass by in the Pacific Ocean was Guam.  Some Filipinos, Mestizos, Spaniards and Native American Indians interbred with Guamanian Chamorros.  What were their children referred to as?  Were they referred to as Indios, Mestizos, Chamorros?

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