here have been a number of posts here on the Hong Kong protests. Even though this sub focuses on issues in the West, there are parallels that people see between what’s going on there and here mainly in terms of Asian-white dynamics.
HOWEVER, while many here are Chinese-American and many who are not like myself have questioned the nature of the protests, I want to make it clear that this sub takes no official position on the topic, and views that are more mixed or outright supportive of the protest are welcome here. There is no “right” answer on this.
The other day I had a conversation with a SE Asian acquaintance. I was explaining my POV on why I though the protests had been hijacked by Western forces. He listened but then explained Vietnam’s history with China which I was familiar with but he emphasized his sense of powerlessness vis-a-vis China. And that he saw the HK protestors as brave for standing up to China in a way that he felt the Vietnamese were never able to.
While I did empathize with him while still not believing this justified what these protests have become- I could understand how his perspective adds a worthwhile dimension to what largely has been seen as an “East v. West, white vs. Asian” dichotomy.
This sub encompasses all of Asia; differing views are welcome and no one should feel intimidated from raising them. I would also encourage those who are against the protest to resist downvoting dissenting views to oblivion. Of course, rebutting such arguments is perfectly justifiable.
An open exchange of ideas will benefit everyone. And hopefully we can do better than white Twitter where the debate devolves into charges of “brainwashed CCP chinazi” or “CIA operative”.
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I always find Canada’s support of Hong Kong protests laughable. The last time all this s**t happened, so many Hong Kongers moved to Vancouver and Toronto.
Canadians hate the s**t out of these Hong Kongers who “buy their houses”. They refer to them as “Chinese” despite supporting Hong Kong. I hope in 30 years, this new wave of Canadian Hong Kongers stemming from these protests will realize how fake the international support is.
They’ll support you…as long as you don’t come anywhere near them.
Southeast Asians’ hate for China/Chinese has a long history.
Indonesia has two f*****g genocide against Chinese in the last 60 years (1965 mass killings and 1998 riot).
Malaysia kicked Singapore out for being “too Chinese.”
Thai Chinese were so scared of anyi-Chinese persecution many of them changed their surname to hide their Chinese heritage.
But somehow it’s all China’s fault.
Although not a genocide, Ferdinand Marcos did end up trying to Filipinize the Chinese-Filipino communities by ordering Chinese schools in the Philippines to shutdown, which is ironic since the man himself was Tsinoy. Luckily Tsinoys in the Philippines today thrive especially economically, and with Duterte in power this means Tsinoys who are more Beijing-sympathetic can feel more proud about their homeland without some sort of negative repercussion from more-hardline Filipinos. I remember five-to-ten years ago, any Tsinoy who showed even a sense of pride for China were vilified by other Filipinos, especially from Filipinos who were proud of their Spanish bloodline or the American occupation of the Philippines.
Looking at the recent videos, it’s not ‘protest’ any more. It’s domestic terrorism. If they pull that kind of s**t (burning shops, trashing subways, gov buildings, stations, taking over freeways, throwing bombs, using bats and wrenches, attack citizens, cab drivers, shutting down airports) here in the states, media would report these as terrorism, because their actions fit the definition perfectly.
I am frankly surprised at the freaking restrain from police and authority. HK ppl have a lot more freedom from authority than in the US. Many of them would have been killed by police or even other citizens if they mess around like that here.
Seriously, does the average HKer feel safe today compare to months ago bef ore all these started?
As an international students from mainland, i don’t really expect people here to all out pro-China. But if you are as woke as you think you are and you know that western propaganda is harmful to asian communities in general, I would expect that people here should be able to see through the propaganda and form their own point of views. If you still can’t accept what Chinese or Chinese government are doing after finishing your own research, I am fine with whatever opinions you have. But what i can’t accept is on one hand, you are decrying the harmful western propaganda toward asians, on the other hand, you will accept all the western propaganda about China.
Also, i believe the rise of China definitely has an influence over asian identity. China is the biggest country in Asian and had been the most dominant power in Asia for really long time. Thus, its influence over other Asian identities should also be strong. Therefore, the rise of China is basically how Asians with asian cultures are cultivating their own point of view, their own ways of lives in modern societies, which are largely influenced by western cultures and values. At the end of day, the success of China tells other Asians that there is nothing wrong being Asians and you don’t have to reject your own cultures to succeed in modern societies.
I do not agree with your post, in particular your second paragraph. On one hand, sure it’s great to see an Asian country rise above, but China also has imperialist influences. It uses its influences in a very similar manner as US imperialism and its rise can also signal tension in other Asian countries. Like the original post claims, it’s much more complex than white v Asian; Asian colonialism and imperialism towards other Asian countries is just as threatening as other forms of colonialism and imperialism. So it’s natural for other countries to feel just as threatened by China as the US. I do not agree with some HK protesters attempting to side with former colonizers or the US, but that doesn’t mean that I don’t think HK people should have claims over their own government. It doesn’t have to be between US/Britain or the CCP. I believe neither should also be a viable option.
IMO, I find it’s really disgusting is that every whites (not those in HK), because all their knowledge of it is watch western news, is to side the disgusting cockroaches. So, how do you educate a non-HK “democracy” supporter about the whole thing, they are so naive
One liberal guy, I pinned him down on the floor because of his naive views (crying police brutality). As that result, I was banned from that social group (though I really couldn’t about being at anymore)
There is this sexpat streamer, who only being there for a year. His full time job now is streaming protests and airing his anti-China views. He even has the gall to defend rioters for their actions, whether it’s destroying properties, claiming that they are “fighting oppressive forces” and it seems every one of these WM journalists are all the same too
Now you know why this protest is a breeding ground for any anti-white movement and I grown hating liberals because of this.
My honest “impartial” opinion, China (CCP) has been using this event as a prop for nationalism sensation since average mainlander already has some bitter feeling about Hong Kong. Western (mostly US) media was using this as a distraction from current domestic political fiasco and almost certainly side with “peaceful protesters”. At the end of day, it is the average Hong Kong people have to suffer. Your view on this issue is exactly where you a*s sit at.
I have great sympathy to the average Hong Kong people, but this has no good ending for them. Meanwhile, the greatest hypocrisy on Reddit I have personally witness:
(1) Predict “Tiananmen 2.0 tank roll in bloodbath” since June, and four months later, all they can grasp is just a couple of suicides with hearsay. Two people were shot, one by rubber and the other by live ammo, and the latter video clearly not supporting protester’s cause therefore even the protesters quietly played down the video.
(2) The “harvest organ” propagated by Fa Lun Gong (China Tribunal) is dialed to the max level in the last couple of days, and mixed with “concentration camp”, “Tibet”. I bet you give average Redditor a map and they can’t point out HK, Taiwan, Xinjiang, Tibet using their fat fingers.
(3) The used-to-be subtle racist comment towards Asian/Chinese is now walking in the broad daylight, even the “eat dog” comment from D&C is now justified as CCP manipulating people to boycott.
On the other note, I think the whole NBA thing is blew out of proportion on the CCP side, absolutely unnecessary and a lose-lose for everyone.
I’m Chinese-American and was born in the states. I have been called every racial slur in the book “Chink, gook, communist, wumao, 50 cent army, dog eater, slant,etc” even by other Asians, because I support the Hong Kong Police and rule of law. These rioters are violent, and this whole riot wasn’t even necessary but is being encouraged by white people(with ulterior motives) who are racist af against Chinese. These white people support burning down the whole city, but are AGAINST giving these rioters UK,Australian,American passports and citizenship. The irony is hilarious, and the motive becomes so obvious. Hong Kong is just a pawn for westerners to hold back and attack China.
Good move on stickying this post. I haven’t posted to or even checked out this sub in awhile due to the excessive bashing of the HK protests in this sub. While I don’t particularly lean in one direction or the other due to how fucked the situation in itself is, it was getting increasingly uncomfortable seeing the number of posts just straight shitting on HK or the protestors.
This sub has been a bastion for pan-Asian unity and to have so many of the recent posts being just downright insulting was turning me off to even checking out the new posts. I’m sure new people to the sub and lurkers feel the same way.
To all extreme Chinese nationalist posters in this sub: you are just as fragile as the white boys who brigade the sub to shitpost about SNL and Shane Gillis. We get that you are pro-China, but to go out of your way to insult other Asians because they don’t see eye to eye with you is just retarded. It’s not bringing anyone to your side. Stop it.
Edit:
Made a certain part of my post BOLD because there’s a subset of people who only see the part where I’m critical of extreme Chinese nationalists and that offends them in some way I guess
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excessive bashing of the HK protests in this sub
just straight shitting on HK
I don’t particularly lean in one direction or the other
but to go out of your way to insult other Asians
That you even think of this as a “China vs. HK” thing shows that you have been tricked to some extent by white narrative-pushing. It’s a lot more complicated than that. The majority of HKers do not like the rioters, and even most of the protesters are alarmed and angry at the actions of those among them who are violent.
On top of that you have literal Western regime-change ops trying to stir up more violence. There is more than two sides as you imply from your post. My link shows a native HK woman being assaulted by 4 rioting males for filming them. How does this jive with the idea of the HK protests?
There are several camps:
The CCPThe HK Government and PoliceThe average HKer
The Protesters
The Rioters, a subset of the protestersWestern regime-change operations, white internet shills, Western media and governments
We largely oppose the last two groups
Yes, it was, GIVEN the motive of the Nazis
https://www.bbc.co.uk/newsround/16691969 :
The Nazis believed that Jews were a problem that needed to be removed. The mass killings of the Holocaust were what Hitler called “The Final Solution”.
Here, we clearly see differing motives between the the Holocaust and the current situation about the camps in Xinjiang. The Nazis simply wanted to wipe the Jews off the face of the earth, simple as that. Meanwhile, the CCP, seeing the Urumpi riots of 2009, clearly saw that there was a significant proportion of the Uyghurs wanted Xinjiang to be independent, something that is way more dangerous to the integrity of the CCP than any western media reaching the Mainland, so that’s saying something, I’m willing to bet that the year that Tibet or Xinjiang becomes independent would be the same year that the CCP falls, leading to the rise of another government that will focus on gaining the territories back. This is an irony that is quiet funny in my opinion, u/Colandore’s discussion on democracy in China emphasized a particular fact: “I would especially caution against assuming that a democratic China would get along with us. It is too big and has entrenched interests that would likely still trigger points of conflict with Western nations. A democratic Chinese government beholden to a nationalistic voter base may be even more antagonistic to Western interests than a CCP that is willing to bide time and ignore its more nationalistic population in the interests of building National Comprehensive Power.”
But moving on, the CCP’s true goal with these camps are simple also, they must eradicate the way of thinking that has led to the separatism in Xinjiang, leading to a interesting term, which is cultural genocide, which is very different from genocide, but still very abhorrent the the mindset of western values. The CCP also isn’t trying to make the Uyghurs into Han people, they are deconstructing Uyghur culture, keeping the parts such as food and lifestyle that doesn’t threaten it’s goal of the expansion of Comprehensive National Power, and removing parts such as the thinking that Xinjiang doesn’t belong to China, which do threaten the goal. As u/Colandore put it himself: “Whatever is left will still be “Uyghur”, but different and more palatable to the CCP’s political tastes.”, whether the new form of “Uyghur” is better or worse than the previous one is up for debate, however the key point to make here is that this has a very clear distinction from the Holocaust, and the people that want to make this out to be a Holocaust 2.0 are being quiet ignorant and disingenuous.
this is all over the news about the mainland government trying to invade Hong Kong
as much as people support Hong Kong there’s not much you can do